Can’t see Warthen surviving, either.

The Mets’ starting pitching is decidedly better than it was last year at this time, but I don’t think it will be enough to save Dan Warthen when Jerry Manuel gets the ax, presumably within days after the end of the regular season.

Incoming managers prefer to name their own pitching coach and staff. To have a staff thrust on a new manager is unfair and puts him at a disadvantage. There’s always the underlying thought  if the pitching coach stays he’s really the GM’s guy. The new manager could interview from the old staff as a courtesy, but there are no guarantees.

That coaches’ contracts expire after the season – unlike that of GM Omar Minaya – should make the transition easier. If Manuel goes as expected, it will mean five managers this decade, hardly a bastion of stability. They’ve also had three general managers during that span to further indicate this is franchise without stable direction.

So, they start again with a new manager and pitching coach.

While the rotation has improved, there’s not enough of an imprint by Warthen to make a difference for these reasons:

1) John Maine: Calling one of your pitchers a “habitual liar,” is not good business. Although it turned out Maine was injured, the process of letting him go out there when he didn’t have it to throw five pitches lost the player, and might have damaged Warthen’s ability in the clubhouse. The team had rebound hopes for Maine but he never made any progress and then came the injury.

2) Oliver Perez: While this is probably unfair with the assumption Perez is a lost cause, Warthen did have two years to work with him without positive results.

3) Mike Pelfrey: Kudos for the fast start, some questions for the slide. There was also last year. Pelfrey, despite showing signs of coming out of it, remains an enigma.

4) The Eighth Inning Guy: All season the Mets have had troubles finding somebody for the eighth inning. A lot of guys have pitched there, but nobody has taken hold of the job. While Manuel will get roasted for this, Warthen must share responsibility.

5) Burning out the bullpen: Manuel kept riding the hot horse until he drops. Somewhere, the pitching coach has to do a better job of monitoring the bullpen arms to keep everybody fresh.

8 thoughts on “Can’t see Warthen surviving, either.

  1. I agree .. my take however:

    1.) Mets team loves to play the injury card. whether its real or contrived or too late. We dont know if they made him pitch hurt of they ignored it. they have a bad parctice in place with medical.

    2.) Though not a fan of warthen, Ollie doesnt listen to anyone. How many big named pitchers tried to help. I wont fault warthen on this one.

    3.) I blame warthen with Pelfrey. taking pitches away tweaking what he had. taking a young kid with good stuff and not making him comfortable and angry at the plate. when he is focused he dominates. enigma yes but in the fact he is a slave to his negative emotions.

    4.) We had taki. now he;s back. also Iggy. he’s back. mobing Taki to starting was a mistake.

    5.) M&M and Warthen all take the blame on this one.

    Ok thats my 3 cents

  2. I think the whole coaching staff needs to go as well as the gm.

    the gm makes about a mil. that is the cost of several ‘cheap’ throw away players that we sign every year. i dont think his contract can be an excuse to keep omar.

    I think ollie has gotten worse under the 2 years under warthen. last year he had some decent games. this year was a complete bust.

    mike has been consistently inconsistent. however he has 4 pitches now where he had 2 maybe 3 in past years.

    i cannot chalk the 8th inning guy to warthen. talent is talent. pedro has not been able to grab the 8th slot. the other guys just dont have much talent.

    can dickey be chalked up to warthen?

    burning the pen. i see this as jerry, jerry, jerry. who is responsible for having a guy warm up for 4 innings straight? the pen coach or the head coach?

    overall, i think the starters all showed improved control over more pitches. is that the pitching coach? ollie is a waste and clearly no one save the jacket has had any success with him.

    maine is just injured. did the jacket keep maine and ollie on some path to make them better or was that one year a fluke?

  3. SteveC (1): Maine did have a history of not being forthcoming about injuries. …. As far as Perez goes, you’re right, others have failed. But, he did have some time with him and there was no progress. Not even a glimpse.-JD

  4. dave (2): Dickey is a knuckleballer. I guess he’s pretty much self-taught. Warthen could get some love on encouraging Dickey to throw his fastball more. …. Yes, it was Manuel’s call to burn up his relievers, but he needs input from the pitching coach. … In Warthen’s credit, the walks are down, but how much is that due to not having Maine and Perez?-JD

  5. steve

    good point on taki.

    he has been great in the pen. lack of starters moved him to the rotation + a stubborn refusal to promote misch.

  6. 3.) did he? or was it a cover up to make management look good. hey kid i know your hurt. lets see if you can tough this game out. Then bang scape goat. In all hinesty we don’t know the dynamics of the MMIDL – mets Mystery Injury Disabled List

    5.) i think the promotion meant sending someone down. When Ollie got “injured” that was the time to bring Misch in and put Taki back.

  7. SteveC (6): Correct. Because even then we knew Takahashi was a once-through the rotation starter. The team was just in the beginning of its slide then so it’s anybody’s guess how things might have turned out.-JD

  8. So far I think Misch has done well.

    He did well last year too I think and pitched well in AAA all year.

    I understand he is out of options so if they kicked him up and then sent him down they would have lost him.

    Presumably this was all to ‘save’ Ollie. Who by the way is unsaveable. If they brought him up 2 months ago things might be different. They might have ended up fighting for last place again, but certainly not pitching with a full staff of starters hurt them.

    As John pointed out many times it also hurt the relief corps because Taki was very effective coming in and pitching an inning or more.

    Of course Mejia could have been sent down sooner when it became obvious he wasn’t going to help as much as Sybil had hoped. Mejia lost a lot of time this year not learning how to be a starter. Also he gained a lot of time in the majors not doing much.