METS CHAT ROOM: Game #90; sinking fast.



I would rather not use the word “freefall” but the options are getting fewer. Realistically, I don’t see much cause for optimism. This is a team with too few healthy parts, and those that are, aren’t playing well. Can they turn it around? Yeah, it’s possible, but do you see any signs of life indicating they will?

I don’t.

I also don’t see any help on the horizon. Matt Holliday isn’t coming. Neither is Roy Halladay. Neither is Adam Dunn. Neither is anybody else of substance. The Mets simply don’t have the chips – without scuttling their farm system – to make a significant deal.

They will wait for Jose Reyes and Carlos Beltran to get better and consider them as “the best trade we could make.” What nonsense. They weren’t playing well when those guys were healthy. As far as Carlos Delgado is concerned, frankly, I see him wanting to come back for only one reason, and that is to prove he’s healthy enough to sign with another team this winter.

They will add Julio Lugo to rest Alex Cora, but let’s face it, who really cares? The best thing about Lugo is it might force the Mets to release Tim Redding.

Johan Santana goes today in an effort to stop the slide. I can’t begin to count the times I’ve written that sentence this season. Trouble is, Santana has been less than an All-Star since he was roughed up in San Francisco. The home runs keep coming off him.

There were no signs of life in last night’s debacle. One has to wonder if internally the Mets aren’t thinking among themselves that it is over.

98 thoughts on “METS CHAT ROOM: Game #90; sinking fast.

  1. El Duque was released by the rangers from his minor league contract. Any takers?

  2. Yesterday during agility drills Reyes stopped and pointed to his hammy. I guess the cortizone wore off. They are talking Surgery now for Beltran. He was smart enough to get a second opinion and they found a micro fracture in his knee. Delgado will probably be the only one of the trio we see this year.

  3. Here we are adding Lugo, a player whose contract is being eaten by the best run team in baseball. Where, oh where, did the promise of 2006 go? Letting Chad Bradford go was the beginning.
    What the Wilpons have to do is to straighten out the whole organizational incompetence. Meanwhile we have this tidbit from Adam Rubin “A source Friday relayed to the Daily News a recent conversation between two players. One player noticed swelling in the other’s knee and asked why he wasn’t getting it treated. ‘They don’t want to hear about it, the injured player replied, according to a source.” Great, just great (heavy sarcasm). If true, time for the players association to get involved.

    I would like to thank my employer fro changing my work hours last March so instead of going into work at 11PM, I now go at 7 PM. And miss disasters like last night 5 days a week. ‘

  4. Well it IS over, but a few guys on the club have an opportunity to show management what they can do to be a part of the club next year and beyond.
    Take Angel Pagan.
    I’d really like to see what he can do over the course of a full season. I like him as a leadoff or No. 2 guy in the lineup. He hits the ball with authority and has good speed.

  5. Gil (5): Pagan could make an impression. I’m not so sure F-Mart will be a starter next year. He has a long way to go. So, maybe he can be in the outfield with Beltran and Francoeur.-JD

  6. I don’t exactly know why, but that “Flo” chick on those Progressive Insurance TV spots is really cute. Kinda hot, actually. Just something about her…

  7. Pagan has been a pleasant surprise along with Pedro Feliciano and Gary Sheffield. K Rod is pretty good, Santana acceptable. I am done saying good things.
    I don’t know how much you get get out of a 27 year old outfielder but give him a shot and let him prove me wrong. If I’m wrong, then I’ll sent my resume to the Wilpons to be a scout or GM.

  8. Going back to Dan’s point. I think the Mets’ whole medical philosophy has to be evaluated. Hell, with the way thing have gone, they should give a MRI when a guy sneezes.-JD

  9. #9 Try Stephanie Courtney on imdb or images. That’s the actress’s name. Yes, she is appealing.

  10. 11 I’ve said for weeks the Mets’ medical staff needs to be canned en masse. Leave the hospital alone, but everyone from the head trainer down should go.

  11. F-Mart should be moved – too many injuries for such a young guy – i smell an injury bust move him while you can or youll have another milledge – wasted value on your hands

  12. 12 Yup, Dan. I already looked her up on I saw she’s been in a few movies and TV shows and is an improv comedian. She’s a peach. Very easy on the eyes.

  13. 14 ed: F-Mart is only 20 years old, dude. He hasn’t even played a full two months in AAA. He deserves more time there before we write him off as the next Alex Escobar or Lastings Milledge.

  14. What a small market mentality. Sheffield released, pick him up for the minimum, Berroa released pick him up for the minimum, Lugo etc etc etc. So Sadecki they might as well add El Duque, another cheapy. The Pirates are jealous.
    10. Dan. Your boss should be rewarded for his kindness to you!!! As for Feliciano trade him if you can get anything for him

  15. 18 LOL! Hey, by the way, JD, you get those Egg McMuffins this morning?

  16. (17) Gil he hasn’t played two full months anywhere ( exaggeration) due to injuries and he’s been in the system four years

  17. Gil (20): Not today. Maybe tomorrow. Egg McMuffins are the only thing I go to McDonald’s for. … Of course, if Stephanie Courtney was working the counter I might be inclined to order something else.-JD

  18. 22 great point, ed. Maybe F-Mart’s the next Moises Alou! Seriously, though, can a player really be faulted for getting hurt if he’s not being careless in the field and while training? Could be that F-Mart’s just been a victim of bad luck.

  19. OT – any golfers here see the tour de force by 59 year old Tom Watson this morning at Turnberry?

  20. 22 JD: Good thing this isn’t a Fantasy League blog, otherwise looks like a bunch of us would be fighting each other to draft Stephanie Courtney! :)

  21. I rem. being a teenager young 20 year old and i ran through walls I never got hurt until my 30s no matter what i was doing – then there were guys who were made of glass and seemed hurt walking down the stairs .. seriously too many injuries from 16-20 – thats your most durable years

  22. (27) who – argenis the guy we just dropped for hitting .095- oh that other guy, is he still with us – i think i just heard something about pulling up lame in a agility drill yesterday

  23. Speaking of young outfielders who have come up through the Mets’ farm system, I heard the oddest story yesterday.
    I was listening by sheer happenstance on Sirius to the Canadian Broadcasting Company (CBC) station while driving and a feature story aired about MLB players staying at Milwaukee’s Pfister Hotel, alerting staffers about strange noises and other oddities in their rooms and that a local legend is that the ghost of the owner of the hotel, Charles Pfister — a big Brewers fan — is spooking opposing players staying there, from the grave.
    The reporter doing the piece said some players were so creeped out that they changed rooms — and that one of them was former Mets outfielder Carlos Gomez, who allegedly was so frightened he left his room and spent the night sleeping on a couch in the lobby!
    Don’t know if that happened to Gomez as a Met or a twin…

  24. 28. That’s what happens when you mask injuries with cortisone. You falsely remove the pain that should be there and help to reinjure the damamged art of the body. Cortisone for soreness and swelling not tears and pulls. Malpractice by the Met organization.

  25. How many guys in the line-up saw prado make that play and went here we go again – its human nature

  26. Harry (30) I can imagine that the ‘medical’ staff of the Mets would make some mistakes, but don’t they also send players to the Hospital for Special Surgery? I can’t imagine shoddy care there.

  27. 32. Agree Annie…

    Mets should trade Rodriguez. 1. The least important player on a bad team is a closer. 2. He only has a three year deal. They can’t fill enough holes to be good during this time. He could get some qulaity young guys, and if they becoe good again they can buy another closer.

  28. Harry (33): That would be hard to do. When you trade a player you signed as a free agent during his contract, he can demand to be a free agent again. No team would make that deal unless it was willing to offer an extension. That would be expensive.-JD

  29. Harry (33) The Mets themselves should watch Santana play the game – he is in it every minute and most of this team isn’t. Many of them don’t even seem to understand how the game is played. I haven’t seen such a complete pitcher on the Mets since Ron Darling, but then, the intelligent ones always stand out. Santana is one of those.

  30. 35 Annie, I don’t think what you perceive as the Mets’ fielders lack of attention to Santana is the problem. Problem is, we’ve got a bunch of guys playing everyday due to injuries that are either new to the Majors, don’t belong in them, or otherwise would be riding the bench instead of being everyday players. Bad as the Mets have been playing lately, we can’t really find fault with the way they’re fielding behind Santana today — yet.

  31. So is this a great pitchers duel..or two inept offenses? We’ll be kind and say the former.

  32. You guys hear the stat Ken Rosenthal recently relayed on the broadcast? Take away Francouer’s five HRs this year with ATL and Albert Pujols is out-homering the entire Mets team this year.

  33. #34 John. The Mets have made a couple such deals in their history. In 1978 they traded Nino Espinosa for Richie Hebner. Hebner protested loudly he wanted no part of New York (he was excess since the Phillies signed Pete Rose). Some clueless mananger named Torre was convinced he could persuade Hebner to love playing for a 95 loss team before 800,000 people with airplanes flying overhead. Didn’t work. Hebner mailed it in and forced a trade after one year. In 2002 Kevin Appier was a lot more willing to go to Anaheim so the Mets could bring in Mo Vaughn for their hot dog eating contest.

    I’m sure on some level K Rod is disappointed his free agency year coincided with an economic downturn which cost him tens of millions and would want a contract extension to make up for it. It might be worth exploring, but I doubt it will happen.

  34. 39 Dan: LOL! Mo Vaughn for the hot dog eeating contest? Hilarious, as is your Richie Hebner take. And no way I trade K-Rod. We get competitive again the next two years, you want him around.

  35. Is it just me, or could Francouer pass for being John Rocker’s younger brother? There’s some resemblence there…

  36. A friend wrote me this morning that these Mets are only playing for the money – they don’t care about each other and are not a team in any way – all they want is the paycheck. This person watches a lot of baseball and understands the game.

  37. 42 Annie, that may be the case and it may appear that way, but unless “this person” is actually in the dugout and clubhouse with these guys, it’s purely speculative — and a pretty serious accusation.

  38. How exciting. We score two runs on a bases loaded walk and a fielder’s choice. Yawn.

  39. Gil (43) I get some pretty interesting mail. Like from my nephew who works for the CIA and keeps telling me to warn those who are on Facebook, Twitter etc. that everything they write is in the public domain and not secret. Gov. Sanford found that out recently with the Argentine emails, didn’t he.

  40. 45 Annie, no offense to your nephew, his work and his investigative skills, but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that any and all material on Facebook and Twitter and whatever is said or “texted” on cell phones — and in this very chat room –is public domain.
    But what does any of that have to do with the motivation of the Mets and what they’re allegedly saying and feeling inside their clubhouse?

  41. Very glad to see that no one is in the Mets bullpen. Want Santana to stay in til the end of the game.

  42. 48 Ah, Ok. For a minute there, I thought you meant you had a CIA contact inside the Mets’ clubhouse. Maybe that’s the program Dick Cheney alledgedly kept secret from Congress.

  43. Gil (50) Is the ‘Politics Light’ on? OK – I have no contact inside the Mets clubhouse – wish I did. Dick Cheney will rue the day that he took on Nancy Pelosi – a tough broad from Baltimore where her Dad was the Mayor while she was growing up.

  44. 51 No, politics light is not on, Annie. Just making a current events joke as it might relate to your “insider” info on the Mets. :)

  45. Used to have a Mets contact and I have met Fred Wilpon. Still have a Yankee contact – that’s all I’m saying.

  46. Ah, here we go again. No starting pitcher allowed to go the distance and pitch a complete game shutout…

  47. I swear I hate modern baseball’s unwritten rules. Let a pitcher go the damn distance. Soon as Santana’s lifted, $#*! happens…

  48. This is what I can’t stand about the Mets – they never leave their pitchers in, now look, they’ve lost the game for Santana.

  49. Oh no. Sean Green? We’re toast, folks.
    How soon until he coughs up the lead? Another game where Santana pitches his butt off, we don’t support him with nearly enough runs and the bullpen blows it for him…

  50. 3. Dan, I am very disturbed by that story. If I were a Mets player right now, my main concern would be to avoid injury and preserve my career. How is there going to be a good team chemistry? Jerry Manuel tried to make light of it and got lit up by the Media. This fish stinks from the head up. I hope Mets fans will stay away in droves like the late 70’s so Wilpon will have to sell this team. Just getting rid of Omar and Jerry is not enough. Its like the MSG situation with Dolan.

  51. Jerry Manuel has lost too many games by removing his starting pitcher. I think he should be reported to Nolan Ryan. Nolan doesn’t allow pitch counts or removing starters, and I believe he has a long memory and a temper.

  52. 34. Delcos: I read that rule doesn’t apply to contracts signed after 2006. The good Doc in Toronto has that right but not the new FAs if I understood correctly.

  53. Annie, you’d have to have every MLB manager and pitching coach reporting to Nolan Ryan. And we can thank Cardinals’ manager Tony LaRussa for starting the whole reliever specialization and pitch count monitoring thing back in the late’80s when he managed the Oakland A’s.

  54. Here we go again with the genius Jerry Manuel making yet another pitching change. What is it, he has a four-pitcher a game quota? He just should’ve stuck with Santana.

  55. That was a smart play by Francouer and shows the benefit of having him on the team. He’s a smart defender. When’s the last time another Met made a heady defensive play like that?

  56. What is this, Misch is scared to pitch to Ryan Church? Come on and challenge him for God’s sake!!!

  57. That is pathetic. Misch pitched to Church as if he were pitching to Babe Ruth. And Manuel is bringing in freaking Stokes???
    Isn’t this why we have K-Rod? He can’t get a four-out save?!
    This is ridiculous!!!

  58. hello all – im back – looks like the same old from this team looking to lose

  59. It would have been even better if it wasnt on the second base side and Murphy didnt have to reach and come back w the tag

  60. I still would’ve brought in K-Rod. But what concerns me here is that I saw Parnell warming in the pen in case Stokes imploded. Is K-Rod not available today?

  61. Im glad he walked Church. I bet he would have got a hit. So far in this game Church on base 3 times out of 4. Frenchie 1 for 4.

  62. 73 True, Ray, but it’s one series. Church has already hit his ceiling. He peaked last year in the first half. If he were so good, he wouldn’t be being platooned in Atlanta.

  63. 75. Froggy hit his ceiling when he was 23. Has been a whiff machine ever since.

  64. 76 Sorry, Ray. Frenchy has had a bad year-and-a-half. And Church hasn’t come anywhere close to accomplishing what Francouer has –two 100 RBI seasons, a Gold Glove, play in the post-season. Francouer’s career high in homers is 29; Church hasn’t even ever hit more than 15 homers in a season.

  65. Unbeleiveable! I haven’t seen the Mets attempt a squeeze play since the Art Howe era! ‘Bout damn time.

  66. The Mets executed a suicide squeeze.
    Any body remember the last time they did before today.

  67. 77. Time will tell. I say the League has figured him out. Positives by Pagan and Looie this inning.

  68. We’ll see, Ray. But I’d rather have a guy who might re-adjust to the league figuring him out rather than a guy who has never figured out the league.
    Pagan has been nothing but sensational ever since he’s put on a Mets uniform. I’d actually like to see him have a shot at left field next year. And Castillo did a nice job there — and should’ve been asked many times this year to squeeze with men on third.

  69. Boone Logan? Wasn’t that the dude who died on “Lost” Season Two?

  70. Ray
    you posted the Beltran had a microfracture in his knee.
    Where did you read this.
    Is this a new story.
    I read the story he went to Vail for the 2nd opinion and they told him it was only a bruise.

  71. 83. I heard on on the overnight show on wfan last night. A female host. I forget her name. I trust her more than I trust the mets PR dept.

  72. Grab some bench, Larry!!!
    Atta boy, Frankie!
    Split the game ball and give a third each to Santana, Pagan and Stokes.

  73. Heres a surprise for you Gil, Church career OPS is 786 to Frenchie 731. Even with those gaudy power stats franc had early. OPS is the best indicator of production.

  74. Howie’s still away, but this one definitely goes ‘into the Book’ under Santana wins!

    Tomorrow is a Sunday night game on ESPN –

    See you then.

  75. By the way, for anyone interested in setting their DVRs for good baseball special, MLB Network is airing a one-hour program at 9 p.m. tomorrow night on the career of ex-Met Rickey Henderson. Should be good.

  76. SNY is showing game 1 of the 1969 World Series
    after the post game.

  77. Ray (89) I spelled her name wrong – it’s Rubinson, Lori. Anyway I’ve heard her and she is good and knows sports.

  78. I think it’s great that the Mets can put a completely different team on the field every day. Those “Mets” yesterday, they were obviously NOT the same group as these “Mets” today.

    (9) Gil, I have to disagree. I don’t find that “Flo” on the Progressive ads remotely attractive. No sex appeal whatsoever.

  79. 88 Not everyone agrees that OPS is the be all and end all measure of producticvity, Ray. Francouer has outdone Church in every other important offensive and defensive category. And Francouer is also five years younger, with tons more upside.
    And I’m not alone in preferring Francouer to Church. Seventy percent of Mets fans who responded to a PIX cell phone poll the other night also prefer Francouer to Church.
    I admit, it was hard at first to embrace Francouer because he played so long for the enemy, but I always did admire how he played hard and showed smarts.

  80. 94 LOL! Well, Jeff, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, isn’t it? I’m sure we could find some women in the limelight we could agree on. :)

  81. work has kept from the site but maybe thats a good thing with the way the mets have played. id like to see more days like yesterday where the mets play the ultimate small ball to manufacture runs…wrights power #s are disturbing

  82. Jim (97) Hope you got to see some of the Open – Tom Watson went as far as he could – to a playoff which he lost to Cink.