METS CHAT ROOM: Game #40; avoiding the broom.



The future is now for Daniel Murphy.

Murphy, the Mets’ first baseman of the future, will start at the position tonight in Los Angeles as the club attempts to avoid being swept by the Dodgers. Manager Jerry Manuel said Murphy would also start the three games in Boston.

Manuel has been going with Jeremy Reed and Fernando Tatis at first in place of Carlos Delgado, who underwent hip surgery Monday and will be out at least two months.

All I can say is it’s about time. Circumstances dictate drastic measures and that includes seeing if Murphy can handle the position. There’s only one way to find out, and that is to play him.

Here’s tonight’s line-up”

Jose Reyes, SS
Luis Castillo, 2B
Carlos Beltran, CF
David Wright, 3B
Daniel Murphy, 1B
Ryan Church, RF
Ramon Castro, C
Angel Pagan, LF
Livan Hernandez, P

231 thoughts on “METS CHAT ROOM: Game #40; avoiding the broom.

  1. 1 I just saw that on
    Schoeneweis REALLY had it rough, with both his daughter’s situation last year, too.
    No one deserves that much trauma.

  2. Delcos. With as much baloney as Manuel has spewed since Spring Training do you really think he’ll leave Murphy alone for 4 games. Nothing like telling a kid, already struggling, you got 4 days to please Jerry the Horrible, Czar of Chiti Field or you will be sent to our gulag in buffalo. Good going Jerry. You are really King turd.

  3. So why does Gary Cohen have to remind us about the 2006 NLCS loss?

  4. 9 Not if he kicks the ball around over there the way he has in left field…

  5. Thank goodness Church wasn’t on first or second on that Beltran double — he would’ve missed third trying to score.

  6. Murphy learning to play 1B in the majors tonight? What’s the record for most errors by a first baseman in a game?

  7. 12 As I’ve so often said, Murphy showed plenty last summer, which elevated his trade value and the Mets should’ve traded him THEN to have gotten the pitching help we still need.

  8. Harry (6) I saw/heard Jerry’s interview this afternoon with Mike Francesa. Jerry certainly looked uncomfortable and behaved like your kids do, when they know that you know that they screwed up.

  9. Don’t that that strikeout while looking will boost Murphy’s defensive confidence.

  10. Hate to say this, but Murph is quickly becoming the second coming of Mike Vail — who can’t field.

  11. This is RIDICULOUS!
    Murph came OFF the bag?!!
    Can we PLEASE trade him to an AL team so he can DH?

  12. Oh please guys, can we have a moratorium on Murphy criticism for at least a week?

  13. 9. Delcos. Of course its too short a time frame. Its pathetic.
    10. Gil. you show your total ignorance of the game with your comment.
    I have moved Jerry the Horrible ahead of Joe Frazier as the absolutely worst manager in the history of the Mets.

  14. No more Murphy bashing from me for the rest of the night. A week is too long to promise.

  15. 26 well Harry, just crown you the new Insult Master, you rascal!
    So I’M ignorant because I want a proven defensive liability to have a short leash at another position where he could cause equal damage?

  16. Harry, Jeff Torborg will always be the worst manager in Mets history for me with Art Howe closely behind. But Cobra Joe Frazier was pretty bad.

  17. These guys need to make up their mind. I mean Manuel was commited to having Murphy hold down LF and really learn that position and now he’s changing his mind after a little over a month. The guy played a very serviceable LF last year and I’m absolutely puzzled as to what happened in the offseason that lead to this. I don’t think he’s genuinely as bad in LF as he’s seemed this year so far and I think it’s really stupid that Manuel is making statements saying that he’s done out there. You really can’t trust what this guy says becuse he’s shown a track record already for not being forthcoming

  18. Murphy off to a fast start after getting his ultimatum – strike three and foot work at first

  19. at least ill be able to get some sleep tonight – I lasted to the blake HR last night

  20. JD- did you see his foot work on that swinging bunt he would have been safe

  21. By the way, everyone: Really good reading in this week’s Sports Illustrated — Tom Verducci’s piece on Randy Johnson a basketball column about the decline of Allen Iverson.

  22. Derrel McKinley, there’s another bad one. And his job really didn’t matter if he won or loss but Casey Stengel’s Mets were far worse than the Colt 45s.

    I always wonder about Harry Cashen twisting George Bamberger’s arm to manage. He left the Brewers because of ulcers and Cashen hired him to manage in New York?

  23. oops shame on me. Confusing Frank Cashen’s first name with Harry Dalton, Oriole GM in the 1960s

  24. The hell with this stupid lineup. Church doubles and the next two bums do nothing, leaving up to the pitcher.

  25. (32) Are you judging Mets managers by W-L record? Because if that’s your criteria…

    Winning Pct.
    (Minimum 200 games managed)
    Davey Johnson .588
    Willie Randolph .544
    Bobby Valentine .534
    Bud Harrelson .529
    Gil Hodges .523
    Yogi Berra .497
    Joe Frazier .488
    Dallas Green .447
    Jeff Torborg .425
    Art Howe .424
    Joe Torre .405
    George Bamberger.389
    Wes Westrum .375
    Casey Stengel .302

  26. Failure by Castro to get a productive out. Plus the ball was hit hard but only a double.

  27. 46 We can complain about how bad a manager Bud Harrelson was but his son turned out to be a helluva Samurai swordsman.

  28. 50 Jeff: GREAT research. But if Bud were so good, then why’d he last just one full season?
    Two things I remember about Bud’s managerial stint:
    1. Hubie Brooks coming between Harrelson and David Cone in dugout during a road game to keep them from fighting
    2. Bud’s signing off on a scrub rookie named Kelvin Torve being issued No. 24, forgetting that the immortal Willie Mays wore the number while he was briefly a Met. Rightfully, no other Met has worn No. 24 since.

  29. My man Vin Scully just got off a good line about Livan Hernandez: He shows all the emotion on the mound of a man waiting for a bus.

  30. More in terms of what they should have done
    with the talent. Joe Torre was learning on the job but he had little to work with thanks to 8 years of bad trades and drafts. Bud Harrelson, on the other hand, inherited a team that won the NL East one and half years before he took over. Had a hot 6 weeks once he replaced Mike Marshall with dave Magadan (actually Marshall got one of his numerous injuries) but going with rookie Julio Velera in key September games did it for me. Plus his idiotic cancelling Howie Rose pre game radio show on WFAN.

    Maybe the worst was Dallas Green if you think he overworked Generation K. But he did quit on Steinbrenner when George started to mess with his coaches like he promised he would.

    For best I’ll go with Hodges followed by Johnson. Darkhorse candidate? I’ve been waiting to mention Salty Parker.

  31. 30. No Gil, its because you think a guy having a 4 game test is more than enough. It proves nothing in baseball. Oh, but that must not be. gil says a second in baseball is too much. people say I’m negative but you bitch and scream at every little thing that doesn’t meet your holy standards.

  32. 57 Salty Parker has the coolest name of any Mets manager. How’d he get his nickname, anyway?

  33. 31. I think i might defer to your proclamation of Torborg. I’ve really tried to blot him from my memory bank. But Frazier I won’t cede as worse than Howe.

  34. 62 D’oh! How could I have forgotten? I was completely wrong there, Dan. Thanks!

  35. 64 Oh, Harry. I love how my comments just work you into such a lather! :)

  36. The only thing Willie Mays did for the Mets was pack the Polo Grounds in 62 when nobody was showing upi to see them.

  37. Steve Phillips is right. Beltran can not get a clutch hit, he only pads his stats. That comment should be read with heavy sarcasm.

  38. JD (68): UGH…did it look as bad on tv as Howie and Wayne made it sound on the radio?

  39. 66. Maybe I’ll be as critical of you as you are to Church. How’s that?

  40. 67 Hmmm…I seem to remember Mays once hitting a game-winning homer at Shea (I was there) and getting a game-winning single in Game 2 of the 1973 World Series.

  41. 71 Ooooooh, Harry. I like the sound of that! I mean, how dare I be such a meanie and get on Ryan Church for forgetting something even a 5-year-old Little Leaguer knows how to do?

  42. (70) Yeah, he pulled up at the bag and went hobbling down the dugout steps to the clubhouse. Not good.

  43. Wright’s OBP of late must be ridiculously high. He’s drawing so many walks lately. He’s drawing walks at the same pace he was K’ing earlier in the year

  44. Ed (77): It’s not Ramon’s arm that’s the problem. It’s his overall defense there. I wonder why they didnt call A.Reyes up?

  45. 78 LOL! Well, go back and read who started it. Harry just doesn’t like it that I’m in his head.

  46. i thought he at least got in front of the ball – but he almost couldnt make it to first

  47. UGH. Murphy really isn’t helping his cause with a crap AB like that. That’s a bad job by him.

  48. Gil, You owe everyone an apology for your disgusting comments the other night about 8 years being enough of playing God Bless America. Maybe 911 is nothing to you but it isn’t to all of of us.

    Gil, You are in my head because anti American swine like you get to say and do whatever you want in this country. And that’s the way it should be but you don’t deserve it.

  49. BTW — Manuel hasn’t reached the 200-game minimum yet, but guess where he stands right now? .580 — second only to Davey Johnson.

  50. The Mets’ entire medical and training staff should be fired.
    Last year, they totally screwed up handling Ryan Church’s concussion, they advised sending Carlos Delgado out there on a bum hip, they can do nothing to keep Ramon Castro from pulling one leg muscle after another and now they sign off on sending Jose Reyes out there on a messed up calf and now look…

  51. Annie (90) See my #75 — he was running hard to first trying to beat the throw.

  52. Gil (92): You make a good point about the Mets medical staff but it was Delgado who was advocating holding on any surgery. As for Reyes…I’m totally perplexed as to what this injury is that he has.

  53. Jeff M (93) Thanks – Howie and Wayne haven’t said much, they are waiting for news from the clubhouse.

  54. 88. If Gil can bring up an accidental mistake made by church for a score or so of posts, I can certainly bring up his insulting comments about 8 years is enough. If I made a comment that we should forget slavery because it was over a Centrury ago he’d go off on me and rightfully so.

  55. Don’t worry Delcos. I’m outta here. I thought one day away from that anti American would calm me but obviously not. See ya Friday maybe.

  56. 97 No, Harry.
    I’d respect your opinion and IF I disagreed with such a statement, I’d find a solid argument to express that.
    Now let’s celebrate Livan Hernandez’s 1-2-3 inning!

  57. Jose – How did he hurt himself? I know he hasn’t been playing.

    Murphy – I am sure his problems at the plate has to do with the huge vote of confidence his manager gave him in spring and then the benching and the 4 game tryout as a major league player. He is not as good as he was last year and cannot be as bad as he is this year. In the spring and offseason they had him playing all over the place. If they wanted him to play LF that is the position he should have played since the season ended. Getting Sheff killed him because Sheff has 500 hr’s and he is not a power hitter. There are too many OF’s on this team and he is a lefty. His glove is on the wrong hand at 1B. I think he is doomed.

    His manager is managing for his life and he is a casualty of that. Murphy can’t play in the AL. No power.

  58. Dave (103): Hard to say he’s “doomed” when he’s apparently looked pretty good in the field at 1B thus far.

  59. And Murphy is a guy that’s expected to become a power guy down the road, but no he doesn’t have any right now

  60. How weird is THIS: Randy Wolf batting for Weaver, who was pretty much lights out??

  61. Murphy looks comfortable at first. I shudder at the thought of him playing the Green Monster. I think that had something to do with the timing of this.-JD

  62. 109 I’m not sure I want Murph to hit a lot of homers. I like him working counts and hitting line drives and being like a Pete Rose-type of player (minus the gambling habit, of course).
    But with Murph in the lineup for the forseeable future, we have to get some additional power to compensate. If we don’t go out and get someone else for that role, we can only hope Sheffield and Tatis can do that.

  63. 104

    I know he was hurt running, but he has been out and I assume he hurt a previous injury.

  64. 113

    Sheff had a good series against SF. So he should be the regular LF the rest of the year until next month when the manager benches him and then calls him out.

  65. 116 Sheff probably won’t get a sniff from the Mets next year. With any luck, he’ll have helped us win a ring this year and he retires, so next season the Fernando Martinez era can begin in LF.

  66. Dan: I hope you’re right, but remember that sometimes Livan has unraveled the third time through an opposition’s lineup.

  67. I was reading the manager wants to pull him before the third turn. figures the opposition will nail him in round 3.

    goodnite guys.

    hope they win tonight.

  68. Gil (113): Agreed. He needs to continue doing what he’s doing and if so the power will come naturally. It’s frustrating now that he’s actually having a good game in the field but now uncharacteristically striking out twice in this game.

  69. These guys need to wake up and start hitting. Some of these AB’s have been pitiful

  70. Angel Pagan has certainly come back down to earth after his game on Mon nite.

  71. 123 rmk: Got that right. I really like Murph’s hitting and granted SO FAR he looks good at first base, but I still would’ve traded him in the off-season.
    Sometimes you’ve got to move young talent to get what you need. I really loved Carlos Gomez’s defense and speed and still think he’ll come around as a hitter, but no one would disagree that trading him for Johan was a wise move.
    If Murph could be included in a package that could land someone like Jake Peavy, I’d make that deal.

  72. Well, Peavy hates New York so forget that. But I wonder about the love the Mets organization has for Murphy. Wereen’t they comparing him to Mattingly last winter?

  73. 129 True, Dan, but unless the Mets are on a no-trade list in his contract, Peavy’s not yet a 10-and-5 guy and can’t veto a deal.
    And somehow, I bet D-Wright and Keith Hernandez (another guy who originally didn’t want to play in New York) could work on Peavy to endure three months of playing ball in New York for a possible shot at the post-season.

  74. Richie Hebner didn’t want to come to New York and Joe Torre thought he could change his mind. He couldn’t. Most useless 79 rbis in a season ever. Peavy is good but what I’ve read he wants no part of the big city

  75. 133 Wow, Dan! Richie Hebner! You’re taking us back a ways. Remember his flipping off the Shea fans when they tired of his ole-ing grounders at third base?

  76. This is ridiculous. I can’t even keep track of how many times these sort of stupid crap hits escalate into a big inning for the other team this year so far. Livan did this to himself though by walking blake

  77. Richie Hebner. Gravedigger in the off season. I’m surprised he was able to find fans in Shea to flip off..they drew something like 780,000 in his one year. Move that typified idiotic Mets decisions of the 1970s. Trade a decent pitcher like Espinosa for an aging poor defensive player who doesn’t want to be here. Right behind trading Staub for Lolich as poorly conceived plans. Fregosi and Foy at least had shots at working out, those two didn’t.

  78. Did Wright really only have one play on that dribbler? Wayne and Howie said his only play was to 2nd and he had nothing on the throw

  79. 136: rmk is exactly right.
    And Wright might’ve had a shot throwing to first base. Oh – and isn’t that cute of the Dodger fans chanting “New York sucks!”

  80. JD (139): Doesnt always start with a walk but often times they are mixed in there

  81. rmkmets (140): Yes. There was no play at first. He had nothing on the throw. If he took the extra step to make the overhand throw, he wouldn’t have gotten the runner at second. He really had no play at all.-JD

  82. 138 LOL! You’re right, the ’79 season was the one in which the Mets drew the fewest fans — 700,000 plus.
    But boy, that Rusty Staub trade broke my heart. That trade was arguably worse than when they traded Tom Terrific. As much as we all hated the Seaver trade, at least they got four younger players back.

  83. They should have mobbed Livan on the mound after that out. I can’t remember the last time a Mets pitcher approached this sort of length in a game

  84. Great effort by Livian. And we have the Dodgers matching us in unclutchness!!

  85. The problem with these guys in this game so far, esp Wright and Beltran, is that they’re working the count but they are not capitalizing on the one or two pitches they actually are challenged with

  86. At least he had a productive AB. Now lets see if Murphy can finally deliver.

  87. Come on. No way Murphy gets anything good to hit here, no matter who’s pitching, with Castro up next and his propensity for hitting into DPs.

  88. 162 163 Thanks, guys! Must’ve overlooked my scorecard. Hey, there’s Pedro Cerrano in the stands!

  89. How appropriate would that have been if Castillo was thrown out at 3rd there?

  90. 162 163 …which makes me wonder why Manuel didn’t stick Castro in between Murphy and Church, so we wouldn’t be vulenerable to this kind of matchup…unless Tatis would bat for Church…

  91. Wow…honestly how much damn sense does this make?? Church has hit a double off the wall in this game and he PH’s for him with Tatis…the same guy that he didn’t want to use in place of that crap Martinez yesterday “because he was cold.”

    Manuel really has no clue what the hell he is doing. Tatis better come thru here.

  92. JD (173): That made NO SENSE whatsoever. And now you’ve just taken out your best defensive RF in the process.

  93. 172 yes, rmk, this one’s like that old Hall and Oates song, “Missed Opportunities.”

  94. Torre must have been watching Mota while he was a Met and refused to bring him in. Went with the lefty vs righty which was probably smart. I’m gonna go, stuck my mouth to the shower head and turn it on. AARRRGGGHHH!!!

  95. Jeff (176): I’m inclined to agree with you…but he drove the ball at the least. Murphy is the one to blame. It’s almost so appropriate that he’s had an awful game at the plate while finally having a good one on the field.

  96. Don’t despair, Mets fans…the great offensive force himself, Jeremy Reed, is in the house.

  97. You know what’s funny? You would think that just one of these times where Manuel has made one of these inconsistent/head scratching moves it might work out…but he’s consistently been wrong.

    1. Santos for Castro two wks ago
    2. Yanking Johann in that game against the
    3. PH’ing Pagan for Murphy Sun nite
    4. NOT PH’ing Tatis or Castillo for a
    Martinez last nite (and batting him 6th)
    5. PH’ing for Church there tonite

  98. Not looking good if we enter the top of the 9th one down…we’ve got Castro, Pagan and Reed coming up.

  99. What’s Putz gonna blame this on? An inability to get his adrenaline going becaues the game is tie?

  100. Gil (184): Don’t worry, Manuel will probably PH Santos for Castro so that it’ll look just like the same lineup we went down with last nite

  101. Putz is quietly one of the most overrated aquisitions of this offseason. What a stupid bum

  102. I hope these losers were paying attention. This is the difference between a team that wins and one that loses. You take advantage when the opposing pitcher is danglign the win in front of your face

  103. Walks have killed Putz so far.
    What was he thinking throwing a 3-1 splitter to Ethier?

  104. Nice bare hand play by Heath Bell, barehanding the Baltimore chop and getting the second out. If he was still a Met, he’d have dropped it.

  105. This series really isn’t surprising. These guys aren’t really playing any differently than they were the week prior…it’s just that the Giants aren’t good while the Dodgers are and when you throw the ball all over the field and you don’t hit situationally consisntely, like the Mets have it’s bound to catch up to you

  106. Now they’re gonna play the Bosox who are getting Youkilis back and who play well at home. Meanwhile we have a team that can’t hit or field and a roster that resembles a AAA team with the likes of Ramon Martinez, Pagan, and Jeremy Reed

  107. How is it that other teams can lose a starter or two and still be a force to be reckoned with while the Mets lose a couple of guys and it’s like we’re putting a Triple-A team on the field?

  108. Gees. That hit by Pagan is like in an NBA game when the team that’s down by 10 with 5 sec left, decides to foul.

  109. Come on Reed…home run here and we’ll forget about your errant throw from the other night.

  110. Since the Mets never do what’s expected of them, I’m assuming they’ll do well in Boston.

  111. Wow. What a mighty shot there by Reed…almost reached the rim of the infield.

  112. Well…there you go. That’s where that moronic move of putting Tatis in earlier really screwed them up. Manuel’s dumb move once again comes back to bite him.

    I can’t believe he’s not gonna try to PH here again.

  113. Gil (207): And Fenway is one of the few parks where he can’t win. Not to mention the way this team can’t hit their way out of a paperbag…I’m not that optimistic

  114. If our manager wasn’t so stupid the team might be able to get by. Manuel is just simply not a good manager. I can’t say that enough

  115. Stupidest circular reasoning I ever heard. Gary said they have Sheffield on the bench, but if he hits here and the Mets tie the game, who plays short in the bottom of the 9th? Better to lose now than chance losing later.

    Oh well, it’s all moot now.

  116. Well, look at it this way…at least in getting swept we were treated to Randy Newman’s “I Love L.A.” the last three nights at the end of the game. Love the steel drum solo in the bridge…

  117. Gil, you like Randy Newman and steel drums? Since Harry left I guess it’s up to me to call you an anti-American piece of crap. But my heart’s not in it.

  118. Thursday will be a day free of Mets to pull hair out during. Murphy [played well at first, Half-El Duque pitched wonderful. But 3 for 32 with RISP? On to Fenway where if we lose, it will at least aggravate the Yankees.

  119. Annie hasn’t told us if Howie put the game in the books. I think she must have passed out.

  120. (221) Aggravating the Yankees… that’s true! I hadn’t thought of it that way. And I’m kind of partial to the Sox anyway, so I may have to excuse myself.

  121. what was the game in 1986 when there was a bench crawling brawl (about 50 right there), against Cincinnati and Roger McDowell/Jesse Orosco alternated pitching/playing right? Give me the Leo Durocher philosophy: I’d rather be on the field without a catcher/shortstop than in the clubhouse with a loss.

  122. As I said before, this has the potential of being a looooooooooooooooooooooong year.
    The team has too little home run power, too many bench players being forced to play every day, subpar defense, little depth in the starting rotation, bad fundamental instincts and a manager and medical staff that make some very questionable decisions.

  123. 220 Jeff, LOL!
    Guess in Harry’s book, we’re BOTH anti-American pieces of crap, huh?

  124. Dan, that game is one of my favorite memories of the Davey Johnson era! Classic.

  125. I remember listening to that game on the radio while working that night as a watchman at a beach club. Easy money.