CHAT ROOM
Jerry Manuel said he doesn’t have a doghouse and if he did Church wouldn’t be in it. Jose Reyes is back tonight.
Manuel also said the players were angry with how they played last night. They should be.
This post was written by John Delcos on May 19, 2009
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Carlos Delgado had his hip surgery today and will be out up to three months.-JD
Hey, JD, everyone.
Already, there are things I can’t understand about tonight’s lineup.
1. Allegedly, Ryan Church is in Jerry Manuel’s doghouse, yet there Church is, not only starting in right field, but elevated from eighth to fifth in the order.
*Church should be benched tonight on general principle after his inexcusable incompetence on the bases.
2. Jeremy Reed is at first base.
*Isn’t this the same guy who proved his ineptitude at the position last night?
3. Ramon Martinez, who booted one ball and heaved another toward South Central LA last night while playing short, is starting — at second?
*Did Jerry learn nothing from being forced to play guys out of position?
Gil (2): But he has the same players and the same situation. Manuel said Church isn’t in his doghouse.-JD
3 Church SHOULD be in any reasonable manager’s doghouse after last night. What kind of message is Jerry sending here?
Cost the team a game with a careless mental mistake and you’re rewarded by getting a better lineup spot and a start?
Come on.
Manuel could’ve sent a strong message saying: “You mentally screw up on a scale of that magnitude and you don’t play the next day.”
And I still don’t like all this lefty-righty crap. Murphy could’ve started at first, Reed could’ve started in left and Sheffield in right.
Oh, OK. Gary Cohen just said Sheffield was feeling ill last night and isn’t in the starting lineup.
Could it have been his teammates’ lousy play that made Sheff sick?
Gil (5): It made a lot of people sick.-JD
6 I’ll say this for Church: He’s damn lucky he made the mistake he made on the road and not at Citi and that the Mets will stay on the road for awhile…
OK, there’s the first gaffe of the night…
“The first mistake of the night for New York” says Gary. Here we go again?
ok here we go again … is it too early to say that
Jeff (9): Yup.-JD
Sheffield was ill because he saw the 11th and said what did i get myself into
YES! The Lakers have come back to take a 55-54 lead over the Nuggets at halftime.
Hey, Jeff! Hey ed!
#2
This is unbelievable. Just unbelievable.
Gil Hodges is rolling over in his grave.
FYI, even the usually unflappable Mets fan Steve Somers was saying earlier this evening that he has no idea what the heck Jerry is doing — why is Murphy playing left instead of 1st; why is Reed, a natural outfielder, playing 1st…
Oh My God. Murphy is tonight’s Church.
hey Gil
the problem is they decided to go cheap and sell the fans on Murphy – hoping his bat would make everyone forget his glove- now that we see how bad his glove is they cant doa take back their stuck
Y’know, I remember fervently pushing, in one of JD’s off-season chats, for the Mets to trade Murphy while his value was sky-high and get pitching help…
Murphy is off to a good start.-JD
But at least Murphy is more familiar with the infield. If they’re afraid of him making errors at 1st, well… would they be more costly than his errors in left, or Reed’s at 1st?
sorry to be neg. but if the Dodgers get a lead we aint coming back on Billingsly
Can Johan play left?
Seriously.
I’d rather see him out there than Murphy. Johan’s a good enough athlete.
Murphy isnt major league quality but Mets fans are so desperate for home grown talent they bought the pitch as if it was Vince with the shamwow
ed: you’re not being negative, dude. you’re speaking the truth. Maine is already distracted.
(23) I’m not sure about that. They’ve been unpredictable lately. I mean, except for making errors and bonehead plays at every opportunity…
ed (23): Should we call it a night?-JD
I’m speechless – is this just a continuation of what occured last night?
I cant thats what being a fan is it could be 12-1 im watching every pitch and cursing ther entire time
Big reason the Dodgers are doing so well right now is their stockpile of young talent all over the place:
Billingsley, Kershaw, Broxton, Kemp, Ethier, Loney, Martin…
Murphy played a more than serviceable LF last year when he was called up and forced into the position. I don’t know what happened between then and now.
The problem lies with the whole overall management of this team. Ever since Omar got here the MO has been to force players to be “versatile” whether they are capable of it or not. Everyone remember when they picked up Eli Marrero and Willie told the media that he’d be playing 3B – then Marrero said “Really?”
In fairness to Murphy, this guy was given every indication he’d get a shot at 2B so he spent his time in the Fall league playing that. He was finally then told to practice in LF but he had hurt his knee in AZ so he had to skip Puerto Rico. Then he came to Spring and was forced right into it.
i said the last game in SF was a bad sign this team goes on bad runs
Hey, rmk, Annie!
(32) they called him the starting left fielder and #2 hitter …. he just went from carefree and swinging to pressure and expectations
The defense has sucked all year right from the get-go out of Spring Training
The problem is Murphy is awful no matter where you put – reviews from the Arizona league of in at 2B weren’t good
Hey Gil
We sat here in the off season on this very blog and said it was a mistake to pass on all those left fielders and going with Murphy as the full time left fielder
Lets see what Church does at the plate now. A good AB here can maybe help start to take a little of the heat off after last nite’s nitemare
the kid should be in AAA working on hitting off-speed pitches off all those 15 year AAAA junk ball pitchers and playing 1B every night
Y’know, lots of strange stuff has happened to the Mets the last few years in LA…
*Last night’s shenanigans
*Last year, Blake DeWitt hit an inside-the-park HR after Church fell down
*Last year, Angel Pagan taking himself down for the season by running into the stands after a foul pop
*2007 — Hong-Chih Kuo taking John Maine deep, then Cadillac-ing at home admiring his drive and stylin’ around the bases
*2007 — Jose Valentin fouling a ball off his leg and hurting himself in what’s turned out to be the last at-bat of his ML career
*2007 — Ruben Gotay throwing away a relay throw on a sure double play ball that led to a loss — and the Mets going out to get Luis Castillo
Hi Gil
fly ball gets the run – execution
43 Hey, Annie — why’d you have to send colder weather here?
(42) Yeah, and LA is where the Mets Dynasty died in ‘88.
I wish omar would have come out today and said i’m working the phones, I know I have pieces people need and we will find a trade partner … not this I’m happy with what I have “wink”
Ed (41): It’s not hitting that’s Murphy’s issue. He’ll hit for average if given consistent time. Jerking him around the way they are certainly isn’t helping his fielding either. Just put him in one position and let him play there. This jerking people around that Manuel has been doing has messed everyone up.
So, has Vin Scully said anything fascinating yet tonight? I’m curious to know whether Billingsly is related to Barbara Billingsly of Leave It To Beaver fame.
46 Jeff, gotta disagree on two points:
1. The Mets never had a dynasty
2. The ‘88 dream died at Shea before my own eyes in the loge section when Mike Scioscia took Doc Gooden deep with one out and one on in the top of the ninth…
ugh … well martinez shouldnt even be in the game
Ed (44): God forbid someone on this team would actually do their job and execute. Execution is not part of their MO
(47) But he IS happy with what he has. ‘Course, he was talking about his salary.
49 Ha! Ha! Unfortunately, I don’t have the Fox Sports Prime Ticket feed tonight to hear Vin. Just SNY. But I am switching between innings to check in on the Lakers.
Gil (45)Must have just been moving South – weather here today was lovely.
Gil that 80’s team was a dynasty but they juust didnt have the championships – look at the numbers they put up – the braves were a dynasty with only one championship same thing
Ed (51): True. I don’t know what Martinez did last nite that allowed him to earn another start unless Castillo couldn’t go for some physical reason. You can’t honestly tell me the team is better off with him on the field.
(50) Gil, the Mets never had a dynasty — but they were supposed to. Of course it didn’t actually die in LA; it didn’t even die at Shea. It died in Doc Gooden’s and Darryl Strawberry’s noses.
Louie is slumping needed a nite off
56 yeah, but ed, ya gotta have the rings to be a dynasty. The Mets had one WS ring and one division title and a string of second place finishes from ‘84 to ‘90.
I disagree that team was a dynasty in the same fashion as the Braves in the late 90 and 00
86 is there ring
The fact that Reed is playing tonite really pisses me off. What the hell is it about him that Manuel finds so worthy of playing time?? He doesn’t have power, he’s playing a position he’s not even supposed to be playing, and he made a horrendous error last nite.
I’d at least rather have Tatis in there…at least he has some pop.
that bat wont come off his shoulder
Man…I wonder what things would have been like on this roster had Nick Evans gone down to AAA and tore it up the way he was doing in the Spring.
which is worse Reeeds .380 BA and bad throw or Tatis’ lack of range and .150 with RISP
Jeff and ed (and of course, everyone else): You guys ever see that Harvey Keitel movie “Bad Lieutenant,” that had as a subplot, a Mets-Dodgers ‘88 NLCS with a different outcome?
dogey hoser thats a bat in your hand
Wow…this is a pleasant surprise. Maine helping his own cause off a tough pitcher. It’s good to be on the other side of this for a change
i vaguely rem. that
DID I TELL YOU the Mets have been unpredictable?
Atta boy, Johnny!
Take matters into your own hands.
Ed (66): Reed’s .380 BA is in half as many AB’s. Omir Santos was batting that high two weeks ago.
(67) No… was it a J.J. Abrams production? He seems to be all about alternate timelines…
hindsight is 20/20 because i said bring up ramon but had never seen him at short … Argenis Reyes probably would have been a better option
I know that but nobody has noticed how bad tatis is with RISP he’s around .150 for the season and thats with alot of chances
Ed (75): Reyes would have been a MUCH better option. But I’m guessing Manuel has some man-crush on Martinez much like he does for Santos and Reed and Cora
Reeds bat is hot ( for now) and he has better rnage – I understand forgiving the throw
Ed (76): I mentioned last nite that maybe he’s being exposed now that he’s getting extended time.
turmoil might be good for this team
With all the talk about getting Nick Johnson, I almost wanna say, “What’s the point?” Manuel will probably try and make him play LF or 2B so he can get Reed’s bat in the lineup
definately Tatis is a great bench asset – he will be the epitome of diminished returns if they use him this much
74 Ha! Ha! No. I’m a HUGE “Lost” fan, but no, J.J. Abrams didn’t have his hand in “Bad Lieutenant,” which I believe was an early ’90s film.
But in that movie, Keitel played a completely corrupt, sadistic, sexually depraved cop with a gambling addiction who bet on the Dodgers to win the NLCS in seven games, but the Mets overcame a 3-0 deficit in games to capture the series.
i want De Rosa – Passiac Nj guy plays every where
(81) rmk, that would be really funny if it weren’t so true…
JD: Is Nick Evans officially up with the B-Mets now? I was looking at their roster and saw his name there but it appears he didnt play in their game tonite.
(83) I think I may have caught part of that once. Imagine, Keitel playing someone corrupt, sadistic, sexually depraved and addicted… I would barely recognize him!
there’s only one part of that movie I rem. and its not the mets game
rmkmets (86): He’s in double A.-JD
On a completely different subject…
I’m disappointed to see that former Falcons’ QB Michael Vick is being released from prison in two days after what he did to all those dogs…
He deserved a stiffer sentence.
JD- your take on 1B will they go get one or hold pat
ed (91): I think they’ll go with the platoon.-JD
if evans starts hitting he should give the name of the doctor to pelfrey for that mackey sasser ish balking issue
JD (89): That’s interesting then that they chose not to play him yet. The sooner he could potentially “fix” himself, maybe he can become a potential internal option
a platoon of waht they have ugh
ed (91): I think they’ll keep their chips for pitching.-JD
Looks like Furcal decided to watch Jerry Manuel’s video on “how to play infield defense.”
(96) Keep their chips? I hope you don’t mean bone chips…
De Rosa cost the Indians two low level prospects and he’s in a walk year – how much could he cost
92 This is smelling a lot like ‘07 when the Mets tried a Ricky Ledee/Carlos Gomez platoon in left when Moise Alou was hurt, then tried to fill the position from within again in ‘08 and neither time, it worked.
As long as Wright has crap batting behind him it seems he’s gonna be given nothing to hit
Wilpons should have taken on a partner if there hurting this bad … any other team in contention would have brought in a player
Gil (100): The difference is at least those guys were natural OF’s. In this case they have two guys playing out of position there. The fact that there is NO other 1B option in the organization is pathetic
that would have been close – wright baited the cut
(101) You were saying…?
I was gonna get PO’d about the rundown that Wright just got into, but accordign to Howie and Wayne, the run may not have scored otherwise?
carp would have been the 1B – but he went in the JJ deal and they didnt like him anyway
Jeff M (105): Touche..
Now Church gets a hit. One thing about this game — it makes no sense.
anybody see the mAUER PLAY AT THE PLATE – ONE OF THE BEST PLAYS iVE EVER SEEN
hit the caps button
Ed (107): Yeah Carp was apparently not a good fielder at all from what I read. It’s a major shame that Evans had to get into this rut. He might have at least been serviceable
Ed (110): Yeah it was.
(111) OK, NOW WHAT?
I heard Carp – was a TO type
no jeff i was apoligizing for hitting it
TO type?
Anyone know if the Orioles’ Nick Markakis can play first base?
Did John Maine REALLY just walk the opposing pitcher on four pitches?
What the hell is Maine’s issue?? He’s so stupid. This is why he’s so inefficient with his pitches.
(116) I know. Was pulling your leg.
John (96) – what grade would you give Jerry Manuel so far this season?
Fmart is slugging over .550 after a slow start. Best case scenario would be if Murphy can handle first base to bring up Fmart to play left. Not now but maybe in a month or so.
Maine figured if he got a hit, the opposing pitcher must also be dangerous.
Gil (119): He’s so stupid. I bet he was pissed at himself after throwing the first pitch poorly to him and basically mailed in the rest.
Howie on the fan saying now is Wrights time to assume leadership role with Delgado gone.
I see Maine is determined to hand the lead right back…
WTF?!?!? Warthen needs to bring some water and throw it in Maine’s face and tell him to wake up and stop throwing crap
126 Gary Cohen also just said the same thing on SNY.
OK, how’d Beltran manage to not catch that ball?
Ray (123): I think bringing up FMart would be a huge mistake. He should stay down there for ideally the whole year and really show that he’s mastered that level before they bring him up. THe worst thing they could do is bring him up and have him struggle in an already volatile situation. He’s still only 21
that 3-1 felt good for a min
Gil (130): Not getting the gaem on TV, but with the way Beltran plays defense I’d venture to guess it was because he was playing his usual deep CF
If we need a first baseman, Keith (854 games) is in the organization, and Torre (118 games) is in the opposing dugout.
Is it too late to bring back David Segui? Rico Brogna? Butch Huskey? Is Todd Zeile absolutely retired?
for all the talnet beltraon has he lacks the ability to run forward
This is what pisses me off about Maine. He does this all to himself and then pouts about it rather than bearing down.
jon olerud only retired two years ago can we talk him out
Ray (126) I think Howie is right – I doubt Delgado will be back before Labor Day.
131. Reyes was a lot younger, Wright about the same age. Mets need some pop. Shef not showing the power yet.
yup – he was hoping billibngsly would swing at junk and he didnt and it all snow balled from there
Jeff (134): How are you gonna mention Butch Huskey amongst that group? THe others were at least natural 1B’s with gold glove level ability there. Huskey was about as good as Tatis defensively there
(126, 129) Francesa this afternoon said basically the same thing — with Delgado down, it’s Wright’s team.
Ed (137) I just loved John Olerud as a first baseman – played for both the Mets and the Yankees and was a class act. I don’t think he’s coming back from retirement though.
Ray (139): Yeah and they were brought into much lower pressure situations…those teams were out of it and playing more for the future. This is a totally different atmosphere around this team right now and one that I’d rather not see FMart get ruined in.
God forbid he comes up and has a bad week and then everyone will be calling him a typical mets overhyped bust
126 129 142 But Howie isn’t an M.D. How would he really know when Delgado may be back?
annie you wear a helmet in the field your ready for combat – i like it
Annie (143) and Ed (137): Olerud was a huge loss. Zeile did well as his replacement there but there was definitely a certain drop off
Jeff (142): It’s always been Wright’s team for the taking.-JD
come on maine
Gil (145): He’s probably basing it on past his observation of the way the Mets have handled similar situatiosn in the past
(141) True, but Huskey played 97 games for them at 1B — more than Segui.
Did I remember that Mike Jacobs was in some kind of trouble? I thought he played more 1B for the Mets than he did; only 28 games.
Gees 58 pitches thru 3. We’ll be lucky to get 6 out of him tonite at this rate.
146 ed, remember when Rickey Henderson was a Met and talked about having had a teammate who wore a helmet on the field, but somehow forgot not only was the teammate John Olerud, but that he was STILL playing with Olerud, who was STILL wearing his helmet in the field?
rmk(147) I seem to remember that Olerud would have re-signed with the Mets, but that they didn’t offer him the job – not sure if that was what happened.
Gil (153): That was a myth that started in the Mets clubhouse. I think a bunch of the players had joked about that potential interaction taking place between those two when they reunited in Seattle. It never really happened.
SNY just threw up a poll, What do you think the Mets should do about a 1st baseman? Choices are fix from within, or go outside.
144,Rmk If he keeps up this production, it will be hard for them to keep hands off. Maybe Shef will find his power stroke. The lineup tonight is just too weak.
154 No, Annie. Olerud wanted to go back to his native Washington, so he signed with the Mariners…then years later he ended up back in New York with that other team.
these guys are the worst group of bunters ive ever seen a soft bunt he’s on
Annie (154): No they actually offered him a very comparable salary (if not more) to the Mariner’s deal but I think he just Olerud really wanted to go West
Olerud took a ball to the head in high school – always wore a helmet in the field after that
Man imagine if that STUPID GM of ours had actually signed Hudson to this team.
mets brought in Zeile to replace olerud
156 while outside would be nice, there’s no one appealing and we’d have to overpay.
Just checked on Nick Markakis and he’s never played an inning in his career at first base. I’d take Nick Johnson over Aubrey Huff, but outside of those two, either everyone else is untouchable or having subpar years.
Gil/rmk Thanks for correcting me about John Olerud, it’s been a while.
According to Kevin Burkhardt on SNY, astronaut Mike Massimino from L.I. bought home plate from Shea and has it on board the space shuttle. (I wonder if Reed could find it with his throw?)
162 true, but in fairness to Castillo, he’s played well this year. plus, who would we have pawned Castillo off on and for what?
Hey everyone tonight seems to be going a little better.
Ray
Since you watch the D-Backs
any thought on Chad Tracy
Annie
Olerud said if the Mets had offered him a contract during the 1999 season he would have signed but the Mets never made the offer.
168 Scott, are you serious? You mean that moron Steve Phillips actually DIDN’T offer Olerud an extension in ‘99?
Conor jackson would be nice as well from the D-Backs
No Phillips got Ziele for first base let Olerud walk
which wasnt bad but then let ziele walk for mo vaughn
Gil (162): Just look at the hustle and intangibles that Hudson has displayed in this series thus far. This team could use that.
Scott (168): Do you mean an in-season offer? I’m pretty sure they made him an offer after the season to try and keep him
170 Chad Tracy’s hitting a buck ninety-one right now. Conor Jackson’s also on the interstate, hitting a buck eighty-two. They’ve combined for 3 homers and 23 RBI.
169 Gil
The Mets were acting just like the Yankees in 1999. Not negotiating contracts during the season. This cost them Olerud and they also had to pay more to keep Rick Reed.
168. Scott, I really dont watch the Dbax much. Tracy is not a bad Idea. He put up decent numbers a couple of years ago and dbax are a lousy team this year in financial trouble. Could probably get him for a song.
173 rmk, I agree with you on Hudson, but the only way to have signed him was first dumping Castillo, which Omar didn’t seem able to do.
Unreal.
Maine F’ing around again with an easy out at the plate. Once again he does it to himself. He’s so stupid!
On the Olerud talk, As I remember, the year he left none other than Carlos Delgado was a free agent.
He’s doing his ollie – he clearly let up mentally against billingsly both at bats
174 rmk
Once the season was over the Olerud was going home to Seattle.
they traded for Ziele
Ray (181): But Delgado resigned with the Jays then. He didnt leave them till ‘05
Whoa! Who was the cute girl with the Dodger Dog?
Ed (184): They signed Zeile…they didnt trade for him in ‘00
185. Right, but the Mets werent interested. Phillips was too busy chasing junior Griffey.
Hudson has the range of a center fielder
i thought it was a trade
Ed (190): Nope…they signed him as a FA
188 I remember when Phillips was chasing Barry Larkin before foolishly trading for Mike Bordick. Who was Phillips dangling for Griffey?
Wow…total mano a mano battle between Carmello and Kobe going on
In other minor league news, the Binghamton team has a catcher named Josh Thole who is hitting .344.
193 LET’S GO LAKERS!
this feels bad – they had this 3-1 lead Maine gets out of a jam – then the pitcher gets an RBI, the pitcher starts throwing strikes and gloves are finding balls – i feel sick
Ray (194): He’s the #1 catching prospect in the organization right now. He’s still learning the position though as they just moved him over there a year ago.
they agreed to the griffey trade but Jr blocked it
It’s been a long time since someone on this team hit an HR. I can’t remember the last one
198 who’s “they”? who were the Mets going to give up for Griffey and when? When Griffey was a Mariner, or Red?
192. I dont remember. But I do remember that a trade was agreed to and Griffey squashed it because he wanted to be a Red. Turns out Phillips caught a break with that one.
In just a moment, there’ll probably be a loud roar from the Dodger crowd as the Lakers’ winning score is announced…
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/12/14/sports/baseball-griffey-won-t-accept-a-trade-to-mets.html
201 OK, so it was when Griffey was a Mariner, Ray? Remember who the Mets were sending to Seattle?
Gil (198): He was on the M’s then. The failure of that deal (which would have included Octavio Dotel) lead to them being able to get Hampton a few months later from Houston
Larkin would have been a Met in 2000 if they had given him a contract extension, but the Mets had just signed Ordenez to a long term deal and did not want to have to 2 SS under contract.
Sort of the the same thing with Castillo and Hudson.
Damn that just HURT.
Kevin Burkhardt is reporting that he talked with orlando Hudson before tonight’s game and Hudson said he grew up a Mets fan and wanted to be a Met!
Man Billups is SO clutch
Kobe better hit both of these and then they btter hope Billups doesn’t get the ball with a chance to put it up before the buzzer because I wouldn’t doubt him draining it
rmk: Won’t be clutch enough!
Finally a nice crisp inning
YES! LAKERS WIN!!!
If the Tigers can eat Sheffield’s contract in the city hit worst by the economy then the mets could have eaten louie’s – wilpons just wont do it
I really HATE Spike Lee. What a front runner. Now he’s suddenly sitting courtside at the Staples center cheering on the Lakers. What a phony
213 Great point. But did the Tigers also have money tied up with Bernie Madoff the way the Wilpons did?
213 ed
You have a valid point but Castillo has had a good season so far. He has not been a problem.
rmk: Wow. Spike’s cheering the Lakers?
What a dis to the Knicks.
203- Good job Ed, Cedeno, Benitez and Dotel were the bait. Some nice nuggets in the article including jeter and ARod standing off to the side having a few laughs while their teams were having a brawl.
Thanks, Ed. Awesome link.
Would’ve been interesting to see who the Mets would’ve acquired to be their closer in ‘00.
I don’t know if Gary said something on TV, but Wayne commented on how Maine was “matching” Billingsley just before Loney singled
Gil (217): Can’t stand frontrunners.-JD
Here we go again…
Gil (217): Yeah when Kobe came down with that rebound at the end Spike Lee was standing there courtside right behind him and cheering and patting him on the back
rmkmets (223): What a fraud.-JD
WTF? See there is my point about Hudson. If Castillo was in there he would have done the same thing Martinez just did. Hudson on the other hand probably would have gone all out and caught it and called Church off
Yikes.
Sean Green is warming up.
This game is slowly slipping away.
What’d I say about the game slipping away?
Gees. Watching Maine pitch is like watching Al Leiter during his final games with the Mets. It’s very painful. He’s pathetic.
That’s so fitting that he ended this outing by giving up a single to the pitcher. What a bum.
Maine consistently beats himself each time out and he never learns from his mistakes because he does the same crap the next time and then tells the same sob story in the locker room
rmkmets (228): Maine was very Ollie-like.-JD
Maine still has a long way to go reach his potential.
If not for his gutty Houdini act in the third, we could be way further behind right now.
Not a good line tonight: 5.1 IP, 8 hits and — so far — 5 runs, all earned, plus three walks and 98 pitches thrown.
Gil (231): I think this is what he is. I don’t think he’ll ever be any better. He’s a #3-4 starter at best.
Interestingly, over the winter the Mats and Dodgers were discussing a Castillo-for-Pierre swap.
Remember during the Gooden era they brought in a team psychologist? It may be a good time to try it again.
If we have a chance to get Cliff Lee, Omar better take it.
(229) Now do you believe me that when Maine walked Billingsly earlier, it was because he was afraid of him?
232 rmk: It kills me to see how Maine went from being 2007’s April NL Pitcher of the month and his excellent ‘08 Spring Training to see where he’s gone since then.
Your comparison of Maine to an aging Al Leiter is spot-on.
234 It was the infamous Dr. Alan Lans.
If he were brought back to the Mets’ clubhouse now, there’d be a long line of players and coaches waiting to talm to him.
Looks like the offense has packed it in for the night.-JD
239 Let’s give Billingsley his props, JD. He didn’t win 16 last year and 5 so far this year by accident.
Gil (240): Of course not. I didn’t like this match-up from the outset.-JD
Gil (237): Yeah he has totally regressed and it’s all in his head because he has the talent to be much better.
241 Wish we had young stud pitchers like Billingsley and Clayton Kershaw.
rmkmets (242): Sounds exactly like Perez.-JD
Gil (239): In the same right, the only person on the roster that’s at least battled him at the plate has been Wright. The rest of them were going down like flies before Santos AB there.
Now it’s Angel the great. Let’s see what he does here
242 Yet it’s only Ollie who cops the “head case” rap.
JD (244): The difference is that I think Maine loses focus because he is too infatuated with appearances and tryign to be perfect with every pitch. With Perez, who knows where his head is at
Our two fifteen game winners from a couple of years ago will be lucky to win that many between them this year. Pelfry is regressing also. They are going to need a to score a lot of runs this year. btw Scully doesnt do the whole game himself anymore.
Wow…just watched some highlifhts from the BoSox game on ESPN…Ortiz is just god awful right now.
Gil (246): Not in my book. Even so, Maine is more consistent than Perez.-JD
245 Another pet peeve I have about the Mets middle inning plate appearances — they see too few pitches during their ABs. Billingsley tossed just nine each in innings 4 through 6.
For someone that’s been “chomping at the bit” to play, Reyes sure hasn’t shown it at the plate so far.
rmkmets (249): It’s like he forgot how to hit overnight.-JD
248 Actually, Ray, he does. Not on the radio, but on TV, it’s him alone. Charley Steiner, the former ESPN guy, does radio with him.
With all these pitchers regressing, and lets not forget Heilman, Do they miss the Jacket?
Reyes battling here so far.
252 rmk: Disagree on that. Jose had a good eight-pitch AB to start the game before lining out and just had a good AB there.
Ray (255): Interesting concept. I haven’t considered The Jacket for awhile.-JD
Wow…Hudson actually doesn’t get to one. But see…THAT is the kind of effort this team needs (minus the potential injury)
Gil (254): Steiner used to be horrendous when he did the Yankee games with Sterling. You couldn’t have a more horrendous duo. Sterling is bad enough, and then there was Steiner trying to “out-Sterling” him
Bad break there for the Dodgers, with Hudson hurting himself.
I thought Sheffield was sick tonight.
rmkmets (260): Nobody is worse as Sterling. Just awful.-JD
Annie (262): Looks like he’s better. He was always available to pinch-hit.-JD
Ray (255): Pelfrey actually got better after Peterson left. I think he’ll be fine as long as he can get the pick-off thing straightened out. As far as Perez, he was doing this same sort of stuff early last year even before Peterson left.
Maine is the only one that seems to maybe have really gotten worse in his absence. Last year he was hurt though and this year…who knows?
260 you’re right — that would be horrible to hear…John “I’m the biggest Yankee sychophant” Sterling, plus Steiner.
JD (260): The only person worse than him may be Steiner
265. Ollie was a coin flip the first half last year. This year he has regressed even from that to being a complete disaster. Pelfs won loss is decieving. He has not been very effective.
rmk (267) Have you heard Sterling lately? He really is just awful and wrong a lot of times.
oooooooooh.
Damn. That 2-0 pitch was right in Sheff’s wheelhouse. He missed it.
Definitely HATED that substitution right there. Manuel is a major dunce. I saw no reason to believe that Sheffield was gonna get a hit there. In fact it sounds like he looked awful
Hey leave Sterling alone. I literally laugh out loud when they play his yankees win call on espn.
rmk: Gotta disagree there. You’ve got the guy with power up in a spot where an extra base hit could tie the game and a homer could’ve put us ahead. Don’t know when else we might get that opportunity…
All we needed was a hit in the gap and Murphy can do at least that much. The Sheffield of old was a power threat…right now I think Murphy has more HR’s than he does
272 When Sterling does the “the” part of his “Yankees win!” call, it sounds as if he’s riding the Sybian.
Not saying that Murphy has more power (to clarify) but if you’re gonna PH Sheffield, do it for a crap guy like Martinez, not Murphy who is in the lineup for his bat
Gil (275): LOL.
(269) Annie, why would you subject yourself to that? I don’t hate the Yankees, I’m just completely indifferent to them. They get in the way of the news and weather on CBS 880.
Gil (275): Boomer and Carton have been very creative with those sound clips of him saying “Theeeeeee”
Green has pitched well his last three appearances. Maybe he’s found it.-JD
Well…at least Green seems to have righted himself a bit. Then again, Heilman would have a good outing every now and then…then just when you start to trust him he gives up a lead surrendering or game winning HR
279 On Howard, Fred always plays a clip of some deranged guy screaming alongside Sterling whenever they play one of his “Yankees win!” calls.
273. Gil, Shef has 2 hr 8rbi in 70 ab. Not very powerful. but whats riding the sybian mean?
rmkmets (281): After the NLCS, Heilman was never the same.-JD
It’s been awhile since the Mets went deep.-JD
Jeff M (278) I don’t actually listen to the Sterling/Waldman broadcasts – and being a radio person I do listen to CBS 880 and WFAN (love talking with Tony Paige) However, you can’t be in this area without someone replaying one of Sterling’s ‘calls’. I do feel for Suzyn though who has to work with him – she’s a very nice person who probably knows a lot more about baseball than he does.
283 Ray: Can’t go into the Sybian here — it’s a family chat room! Listen to Howard Stern sometime, if you have Sirius radio and you’ll be clued in.
This is our chance at getting back into the game. We need a big hit out of Wright here
Not feeling too good here with Church and Martinez following D-Wright.
Suzyn Waldman is a bigger Yankee sycophant than Sterling.
Gil (289): If Wright can’t deliver here the inning is unofficially over
If I’m Wade, I don’t challenge him here at all.
286. Annie,I love listening to Tony Paige and Steve Schooze. What name do you use when you call?
291 rmk: You’re prob’ly right.
Well this is Church’s chance for the ultimate redemption.
The odds on Church delivering are …. -JD
OK, folks…
How many of you out there would be daring enough to try a double steal here?
If Church gets on, who do you bat for Martinez?
OK, I know this is after the fact, but what would’ve been wrong with a sacrifice with Church up?
Now THIS is where it would have made sense to try Sheffield.
300 Where’s Tatis?
Gil (299): Have you seen the way these guys bunt? And who are you gonna bunt him over for? Martinez?
Gil, because look whos up now.
Gil (299): In hindsight, why not? But, Church represented their best extra-base hit threat.-JD
I really HATE Manuel. The players are losing games, but Manuel’s stupidity only compounds it. This is a STUPID decision.
So let me get this straight. He’s gonna PH for Murphy with a scoring opp on two different occasions, but he won’t do it for a crap hitter like Martinez who hasn’t done a thing in the last two gmes?
303 304 True. But I would’ve had Tatis or Castro ready. Is our bench paper thin, or what?
ugh
I’m gonna say it now. I don’t care who they trade for…who they sign…this team will NOT win a damn thing with this stupid idiot as the manager. I’m sick and tired of these moronic moves that he makes.
rmkmets (306): That’s about the size of it. I know I’m supposed to know the answer to questions like that, but I haven’t a clue as to what he’s thinking right now.-JD
John (310) I finished the Darling book today and there is a chapter in there about the Omar night visit to Willie last year. It made me wonder if Omar would do that again this year………
What I can’t figure out is how every year, when the Mets have injured players, the bench is never strong enough to compensate for the losses.
We end up using scrubs or marginal proespects who just can’t do the job.
Annie (311): No. I don’t see Manuel being fired. Maybe if they lose 20 in a row. But, they will give him this year.-JD
Pretty play by Wright. He’s had a great road trip.-JD
That little girl from Jefferson elemetary school in those radio ads could manage this team better than this stupid idiot we have
Reed, Santos and Pagan.
Not exactly Beltran, Delgado and Wright is it?
John (313) OK.
Gil(312)
How are the Mets any different than any other team. Did you see the guys who the Yankees played instead of A-Rod.
Endy Chavez, where have you gone?
Gil (312): This team has suffered a big loss with Delgado going down…hard to compensate for that. BUT, it doesn’t help when we have a dumb manager who wants to do it with the likes of Jeremy Reed.
If they don’t beat Jeff Weaver tomorrow, they won’t win again on this trip. They’ll get swept in Fenway.-JD
Gil (316): You and I can see the difference. To Manuel, I’m sure this is his ideal “heart of the order.” These are his 3 boys
318 Maybe it’s a by-product of skyrocketing player salaries and expansion and the thinning of the MLB talent pool. In the ’70s and ’80s, bench riders on deep teams would be starters on others. Not anymore.
Howie has put this game ‘in the book’, but I don’t want to revisit this game…
See you tomorrow…
The only good news I have is F-Mart hit 2 HR’s in Buffalo tonight but of course they lost.
They are .500 on the trip. This team just doesn’t sustain it when they start to play well.-JD
I hope Francesa really grills Manuel tomorrow like he promised he would. I want to hear what this moron has to say to explain a lot of this. He really doesn’t have the slightest clue what the hell he’s doing
Not even one extra base hit tonight.
Billingsley overpowering us, OK, I understand. But their middle relief completely handcuffing us?
I’m afraid JD’s right about our prospects in Boston.
We’ve got to go outside the organization to get another hitter and dump some of the dead weight.
Can we get the heck out of Chivas Ravine now, or do we have to play another game out there tomorrow?
Scott (325): Of course.-JD
rmk: You’re slowly winning me over about Manuel, but can you list the points for us? What do you see as his major mistakes and what would you have done/do differently?
Scott (325): Unless he’s hitting like .350+ and absolutely dominating down there, I think it would be best that they leave FMart down there to do do his thing. Last thing he needs is to be ruined by this idiot manager jerkign him around up here
rmkmets (332): Agreed. F-Mart just isn’t ready for the big time.-JD
That’s it for me. Thanks again guys and gals.-JD
Gil: He’s lost. He says 3 days ago that Murphy is “cold” right now probably because he’s not getting any AB’s to break out of it. So far in this game he was 1/2 with a walk, meaning he was at least battling Billingsley a bit and was able to get on twice. Yet he PH’s for him in that spot. If he was gonna put Pagan in for Murphy anyways, why sacrifice two players in THAT spot unnecessarily?
Using Sheffield there, essentially helped cost them later when Martinez came up and Sheff was already done for the day. STILL he could have taken his chances there with Tatis but he didn’t. What reason did he have to believe Martinez would have delivered there?
335 I agree with you on Martinez for sure. As for Sheff for Murphy, you might be right on that one, too.
But I think we really have to wonder if Murphy can be an everyday player. He started off nicely, but as I suspected, once the rest of the NL learns how to pitch to him, Murph could be brought down to earth.
The Pagan for Murphy substitution Sun nite was another dumb move.
Then last nite he sold out Church and essentially his whole team by not going out to at least challenge and argue that call. At least ask the ump for an explanation! I don’t care if you don’t like the guy.
His insistence on suddenly making Reed a regular has now totally confused 3 different positions – Murphy/Sheffield/Tatis/Church should be playing between RF/LF/1B. Reed (and also Pagan for that matter) should only be the spot defensive replacements. Thes are not guys that are gonna win you anything in the long run. Insted he’s now put them all into one big group and no one knows on any given night who is going to play.
Gil…Murphy started getting yanked around the second he showed any sign of starting a slump. How fair is that? If you’re going to commit to making someone any everday guy, then commit to him and let him swing his way out of a slump.
337 Gary Cohen said on the air tonight that Manuel was directly asked in his pre-game press conference if he and Church have problems and he flatly denied it.
And I read in today’s paper that 3B coach Razor Shines essentially conveyed to Manuel that Church didn’t touch third, so not to even come out and argue. I don’t think that’s selling out a player.
Where I fault Manuel was not only starting Church tonight, but elevating him to the No. 5 spot.
How can a manager reward a player one night after making such a monumental mental error?
How could Manuel start Reed at first after he failed so miserably there the night before?
Well, I had posted before this road trip that I would be happy if the mets went 5-5. The mets are 3-3 which means if they have any chance going 5-5 they need to win tonight. I don’t see the Mets winning more than one game in Boston, if any.