On the Table: One more year for Pedro?

MARTINEZ: Wants one more year with Mets.

MARTINEZ: Wants one more year with Mets.

Bringing back Pedro Martinez for a year was a topic last night in Mets Chat Room, and his agent, Fern Cuza, said the future Hall of Famer wants another season with the Mets.

No surprise there.

“I can still pitch,’’ Martinez told me the morning of the season finale. “This hasn’t been a normal year for me.’’

With injuries and time off because of the death of his father, Martinez started and stopped several times last season. He was never in cync.

Assuming his health, where would Martinez fit?

Johan Santana, Mike Pelfrey and John Maine are ahead of him. Jon Niese will compete for the fifth spot, and the fourth spot in the rotation is uncertain. The Mets are looking at Derek Lowe and bringing back Oliver Perez for the fourth spot.

Martinez is no more than a fifth starter these days. He went at least six innings in half his 20 starts, and only twice pitched seven innings.

If healthy, perhaps he would have won 10 games instead of five. Who can say? Should the Mets give Martinez one more year or roll the dice with Niese?

48 thoughts on “On the Table: One more year for Pedro?

  1. I have a soft spot for Petey. If we can sign Lowe, I’d probably bring him back as out #5 and use Niese as a trade chip

  2. spadanko (1): I would be reluctant to deal Niese because Martinez is a gamble and there’s always next year. I like Martinez in the hope it gives Niese another year to develop so they don’t rush him like they did Pelfrey.-JD

  3. Hi JD! I would sign him to a minor league contract and that’s about it. If the Mets decided to turn the page on Pedro, I would understand. Not sure a man of Pedro’s pride would allow him to accept a minor league deal unless he feels he “owes” the Mets something.

  4. Steve (3): I don’t believe he thinks that way. Not sure many players think they owe the team something. He’s a prideful guy, but I’m not sure how many offers he’ll get – or thinks he’ll get.-JD

  5. JD: I posted this in the other thread, curious about what you think:

    I’m still scared of K-Rod. In addition to his diminished velocity already at the age of 26, the stat that he ranked very low in 1-2-3 innings adds further fuel to the fire. I think his signing can easily turn out to be one big bust.

  6. I mentioned in the chat last night about needing to add some fresh faces and do away with some of the guys who have been here lately.

    I love Pedro and always will. I won’t be mad if he’s retained, but he’s one of those guys I think the Mets need to let go so they can move on.

    Again, if you’re not going to break up the core (which they SHOULDN’T), then you have to let some other players leave to change things up.

    I’m sorry, but there need to be some fresh faces outside of the closer and one other pitcher. Too many bad vibes from the last two years.

  7. I would bring Pedro back if the contract has a low base and lots of incentives.
    You need more than 5 starters to get through a season you really need 7 or 8 to protect from injuries.
    I know this is setting the bar low but Pedro has got to be better than Lawrence Park or Lima.

  8. I would bring Pedro back for only $3-5 million tops. Anything more is not worth it in my opinion. I love the guy, but I think the Mets might be better off moving on.

  9. According to mlbtraderumors.com, Dempster just signed a 4 year / $52 million deal with the Cubbies. Is OP thinking he is worth more or less? My bet is that OP (via Scott Boras’ brain) is thinking he is worth more. Any way you slice it, OP is going to get 4 years…..

  10. I’d sign Pedro to a one year deal as thefifth starter. One of the Mets down falls last year was depth. with niese in the rotation you dont have a back-up plan and the market for starters isnt very deep we’ll be lucky to get one top quality guy. The way the cards are being dealt i’m guessing Jon Garland. Start the year with Pedro if he gets hurt or is in-effective callup Neise, If Neise is the fifth starter and he struggles who do you bring up jason Vargas. Now I’m a Vargas believer but he’s even more of a variable…

  11. Steve (5): I read that stat about 1-2-3 innings and it is worth nothing. I’ve said from the beginning K-Rod is a gamble I wouldn’t take.-JD

  12. Chili (9): I’m hearing OP wants more in both years and money. Perhaps $60 million over five years. You know Boras, he wants the big payday. And, no, while I don’t think he’s worth it, somebody is bound to give him the money.-JD

  13. i would think about pedro on a low $ contract with incentives as #5.

    this gives niese more time to work on his game. he still may be up by may or june, but at least he has more time.

    As for our new #4. i guess any of the names bandied about is ok. it is #4 after all. I wouldn’t mind OP coming back but would think very hard about 5 years even at 12 per.

    He is really a 3 year guy at whatever the going rate is.

    OP would be very valuable if we make post season.

  14. JD(11)-Unless something on the medical reports sends up red flags, I’m thinking they will end up signing K-Rod as opposed to anyone else. I know you keep mentioning the 5-year portion, but he isn’t getting that. I can’t for the life of me see a team out there which will offer him that length.

    So, if he’s steadfast in his desire for four years, they could turn to Fuentes, but from everything I’m hearing, he wants to come to NY and with the length/money dropping from what it was initially, he’s probably going to be a Met.

  15. The Dempster deal certainly impacts OP. I still have a hard time envisioning him getting five years, but he’s most definitely going to get four.

    The Mets are going to have to give four years if they want to grab one of the Burnett/Lowe/OP trio. With the way the market is shaping up and the bidding wars in particular, multiple teams will offer four years.

  16. JD-What is your opinion on what I mentioned in the chat last night…about getting some new blood in here.

    All teams have turnover from year-to-year, but it seems like a lot of Mets fans talk about wanting to see change but then advocate bringing back Pedro.

    Don’t you think this group needs to be tweaked?

  17. The Mets will only end up with one true option for the rotation = Jon garland like it or not…..

    CC= yanks
    Lowe= sox
    ollie= west coast (Rangers)
    dempster=cubs
    burnett=yanks or braves

    everybody else is an injury risk…..

  18. I mention Burnett only because he’s an FA and one of the “bigger” names. Frankly, I wouldn’t touch him for anything more than three years and even that scares me. He’s hurt all of the time. If it’s true that the Yankees are going to offer him 5/80, that is laughable.

    That team went to a “youth movement” for one year and now they plan on throwing out $300mm in contracts this winter to mediocrity (outside of Sabathia). It’s going to burn them.

    As for our Mets, Jon Garland is a fine option…if they can sign/trade for a higher-level guy. If you put an innings-eater like Garland towards the back of the rotation, it’s fine, but he’s going to command a lot of money (think $35-$40mm) and in reality, he’s really on a better version of Steve Trachsel.

    He alone is not going to help this team.

  19. jd- minor thing..anyway you can see how many comments have been made under each post on the main page…like the old site

  20. I would definitely sign Pedro and one of: Lowe, Garland, Burnett. If possible, I’d also think it a good idea to pick up a couple starters willing to take minor league deals, like Bartolo Colon, or maybe Livan Hernandez. To me, depth in the starting pitching is most important with Maine and Santana coming off of an injury.

    On another topic – any chance the Mets pick up a bat not named Hudson or Abreu? I’m starting to think they would both be terrible ideas, but a big bat would be nice to replace Delgado for the future.

  21. I wouldn’t mind Hudson in the least.

    I want no part of Abreu. First, he’s due for a dip because of his age, second, he’d be moving to the NL from the AL and third, he was booted out of Philly because of a ‘blah’ approach to the game.

    The Mets don’t need that.

  22. Interesting tidbit over at Metsblog. Per Cerrone, the Mets are likely to trade for a reliever who has experience closing before they sign a closer.

    He mentions a package built around Aaron Heilman for Huston Street.

    Depending on who else would be going to Colorado, I’d do that in a heartbeat.

  23. The idea of having Street, K-Rod, and Cruz in the pen makes perfect sense. Street could be the set-up, K-Rod could be the close, and Cruz could be the “fireman” or bullpen ace who comes in to tight situations and gets the strikeouts. That trio, plus Show, Feliciano, and Smith as LOOGYs and ROOGYs would be pretty darn great. If it means some dollars and a few prospects – fine – but that is where we need the most help.

    We’d still have enough money to sign one SP and either a bat or another SP.

  24. Hudson’s injuries are not your usual, run-of-the-mill type…that’s why I wouldn’t worry about that. Their not hamstring pulls or things like that.

    Plus, he’s supposedly a GREAT clubhouse guy. Honestly though, I don’t think he’ll end up here. It sounds as if the Mets are going to be pitching, pitching, pitching…as they should.

    I do think they should add another bat, but if they do, my guess is that it would be na OF.

  25. Just to clarify my post (22), Cerrone from Metsblog mentions a Heilman-Street deal…not that he’s heard those names in particular.

    Don’t want false things being thrown around.

  26. I guess I feel like Hudson would be a really, really, really terrible signing because of Ed’s points above. He really is on the decline – he’s not much different from Castillo in 2007 – oft-injured, losing his power, losing his speed, declining on defense. If he gets injured, we’d be sinking 16M a year into 2B.

  27. jk-I can understand your trepidation, particularly because of the Castillo situation. That being said, if Hudson does come here, it’s because Castillo is gone.

    Now, whether or not the Mets take a bad contract back or eat most of his salary in a deal, I don’t know, but I would not say Hudson is on the decline at all.

    Again, he’s gotten hurt two straight years but they are not injuries that a team should be worried about when signing a player. He dislocated his wrist last year I believe in a collision at home and tore thumb ligaments diving into third base in ’07.

    These are not strains and muscle pulls. He’d be a fantastic guy to plug into the two-hole.

  28. Wouldn’t you rather put the money into Milton Bradley or Adam Dunn? Both are younger and have far more potent bats.

    Ten Million could also go into a starting pitcher or a couple of top relievers.

  29. No to Milton Bradley. He’s a ticking time-bomb and in NY, I think he’d literally explode.

    Dunn…I’m very torn on him. He strikes out way, way too much and doesn’t hit in the clutch well…but he’d look imposing for sure. Though being LH isn’t ideal.

    I’m not advocating signing Hudson over everyone else, but someone brought him up so I put my .02 in.

  30. Delcos(12) 5/60 is less per year then Dempster got. The issue seems to be years. The money handed out to average starters the last few years makes 12 per actually reasonable. The question is 5 years. But if you give an old Lowe or an injury prone Burnett 4 why not 5 to OP who is young and hasn’t had injuries. He may even shock you and meet his potential someday.

  31. There has been one pitcher in Mets history who has been given a contract of at least five years.

    Johan Santana

    I highly doubt Oliver Perez will be next.

  32. metsman(32): You are right metsman because the contract would be smart age wise and money wise as a 12 mil contract in 5 years wiill be one big bargain. That’s why Minaya will not do it. He’ll prove his point by giving an aged Lowe 4 so we can watch his skills deteoriate like we did with Pedro and Glavine, or he’ll sign AJ so we can watch him spend half his time on DL.

  33. Burnett is not coming here. From what I’ve heard he has zero desire to come here. Derek Lowe probably won’t either if it’s for four years.

    The Mets aren’t going to keep making the same mistake with older players after being burned so badly the last two seasons. If Lowe accepts a 3-year deal with an option, then I’d be more amenable to it and so would the Mets, but with all of the competition for him, I doubt that happens.

    The Mets will probably have to bite the bullet and sign Perez for four years or trade for a starter.

    I don’t think anyone is gong to give OP five years.

  34. metsman (34) “The Mets aren’t going to keep making the same mistake with older players after being burned so badly the last two seasons.” I will beleive this one when i see it. He might have done it already this Winter. We’ll see how Mr Delgado does next year.

  35. Harry

    Would you rather we give Delgado the 5 or whatever million to buy him out, then go trade or sign a new power hitter for more money who may not be able to handle new york in addition to all the pitching we need?

    I am sorry. I do not see how keeping Delgado for one more year when we have so many things to do is a bad move.

    Please explain how his MVP second half is something you want to give away.

  36. I am on the edge of not even responding to Harry anymore. He is so anti-Minaya and the Wilpons he doesn’t make any sense.

    Yes, the Mets should have let Delgado go for $4mm instead of paying the extra $8mm to keep a guy who hit 38 homers and drove in 115 runs.

    That would be ANOTHER hole to fill.

  37. Chili-I really don’t think he’s going to get five years, unless the Yankees lose out on who they want and sign him.

    Outside of them, I really cannot see any team giving him 5 years. It won’t be the Mets.

  38. See the thing is they won’t put him as the number 5 starter. They’ll put him up there as the number 2 starter and rely on him and that’s the problem.

  39. Benny (40) – are you saying the Mets would put OP up as the number 2 starter? If the Mets resigned OP, I am sure they would do the lefty/righty thing with Santana, Pelf, OP, Maine, #5.

  40. Mike Pelfrey as the number two starter? Yikes. Can he produce for a full season before we rely on him that much.

    Besides the point I was trying to make is that number 2 starter means they’re relying on him to play a big role on the team. If he goes down again, its trouble.

    Haha, thanks for noticing the name! Not many people get it!

  41. The no. 1-5 is meaningless in a rotation. It’s only a number because guys get jumbled up due to off days, skipped turns, etc.

    The point is if they re-sign Pedro and nab another pitcher who is not an upper-tier pitcher, it makes you count on Pedro to do that much more, which is where the problem lies.

    If you sign someone like Lowe, trade for Vazquez or even re-sign Perez, Pedro becomes less of a liability.

    Personally, I think it’s time to just wave goodbye and thank him for the memories.

  42. I agree it is meaningless but “symbolically” it means they are relying on him to play a big role. The assignment is a symbolic level of expectation on that player/pitcher.

  43. dave (36) I actually agreed with keepinmg Delgado. I was really commenting on the absolute knowledge that metsman had that Omar learned from his mistakes and wouldn’t sign old guys any more.
    metsman(37) The world will certainly not end if you don’t respond. Its obvious your in love with Omar, so my criticism hurts you very badly. I actually think you may be Omar. It is an honor to have a GM debate me. You are entertaining but for the moeny the Wlpons let you play with, I’d much prefer having Theo as the GM.
    PS: If Delgado’s first half was the real deal vice the second half, I don’t want to hear any whining about him….. Gee I know when I was last in Shea there were only about 40,000 fair weather Met fans booing him.

  44. I lied…I will respond.

    A)I don’t love Omar at all. I think he’s a decent GM who has made some questionable decisions since the end of 2006, mostly extending older players. The reason I look like that is that I’m commenting on YOUR hatred for the man and utter nonsense you spew about his moves.

    GMs make moves that work. They make moves that don’t work. It’s the way it is. The team has averaged 89 wins since he took over. The name of the game is the postseason and championship and he has built a team that *should* have been there three straight years. Is it his fault that the Mets have chosen to play .353 baseball over the final 34 combined games in ’06 and ’07 after playing at a .569 clip the remainder of those two years?

    B) About Delgado…I don’t think he’ll do what he did last year. I think he’ll probably hit around 30 homers and drive in 100 runs, which is more than enough. He’s getting older so maybe he does dip again, but you act as if his 2nd half is out of the norm for this guy. A ton of Mets fans do. This is a player that reached 30 homers for 12 straight years heading into ’07 and is 31 away from 500. He’s a borderline HOFer.